MA for Husker Du

MA for Husker Du

Postby HuskerDu » Fri Mar 13, 2015 1:30 pm

Hello,

I am new to this site and registered not only due to general interest, but more so because I am currently "shopping" around for a new or "revitalized“ direction in my skiing. Having been somewhat aware of PMTS in the past (eastern skier), I think the aspect of "dump everything and start over" felt too prohibitive due to constraints in time commitment as well as a natural aversion to anything remotely associated with studying and homework. However, due to aggravating circumstances, I am returning to skiing after serious injury recovery which presents an emerging sense of starting over from which I plan future skill development. I have only skied a few times on very easy terrain this season but have recorded some of it on video and have warmed myself up to the PMTS checklist which seems to be VERY refreshingly concise and in tune with the way my inner skull works.

While I am trying to get used to a new back (entire lumbar & thoracic vertebrae fused in column), as well as simply approaching 50, I think I should still be able to perform most suggested movements upon attempted adaptation and repetition. I plan to invest some time and resources in the off season to absorb the program but wanted to get it connected with my skiing upon this season’s restart just a few weeks back before I may regress ingraining old habits. My boots are canted for neutral alignment, I maintain typical 2/3 bevel angles on my edges and ski on a 12 m ski. I am 6’4” and 195 lbs.

I think that the video will show an ability for certain movements, an aversion for others and an inconsistency from having been absent from skiing over the past few years. I can see how the occasional unnecessary inside knee inward angulation betrays my age in terms of how long ago I learned to ski (old habits die hard). It may be noticeable how I try to make certain movements while attempting to “keep my back out of it” so to speak and may be getting me a bit fowled up. I have fully read, understand and agree to “what to expect when posting video”. Not having expected to be back on the boards at all ever again for quite sometime and now having had the shock of how I look on skis set in by now, the male ego should easily be in check.

Thank you in advance!

Clip
https://youtu.be/oCx5QwWpSuY
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Re: MA for Husker Du

Postby arothafel » Fri Mar 13, 2015 5:35 pm

For ease of viewing the link above. ---
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Re: MA for Husker Du

Postby geoffda » Sat Mar 14, 2015 12:13 pm

Hi Husker Du. If you want to start with PMTS, you are going to need to fundamentally change your approach to skiing. Right now, you are focused on your big toe edge, using it as a platform to push off of so you can move your hips laterally into the new turn to try to generate angles. Often you extend both legs in transition to help with the hip dump, but even when you are incorporating some flexion of the new inside leg, you are still pushing off. In general, this results in you spending most of the turn out of balance. You are often too far back and generally you have too much weight on the inside ski. In a few cases, you lose lateral balance entirely when chasing big angles and end up completely on the inside ski. In some of the shorter turns you are trying to get ski performance by driving your knees, which is very harmful to your ligaments. All in all, your current approach gives you very little control over your skis.

If this is the way you prefer to ski, and you aren't willing to give it up, it will be very difficult for you to develop into a PMTS skier. First and foremost, PMTS requires developing the ability to balance on the outside, or stance, foot. Once you have a semblance of one-footed balance, you must learn how to release, transfer and engage. Ultimately, you will learn how to use movements of the inside half of the body--particularly the little toe edge of the inside ski--to dictate ski performance. These concepts require developing specific movements in isolation and then integrating them into skiing. It is a process that requires a good deal of time working on precise movements on gentle terrain. These movements will be absolutely at odds with what you are doing now, which means you will need to spend most of your time practicing the new stuff in order to replace what you currently do. The new movements will seem different and will likely pull you out of your comfort zone. It will take time before they work for you at speed and even more time before you can experience some semblance of the turns you are trying to make now. IMO, it is absolutely worth the investment, but (and I'm speaking from experience here), you have to throw away what you have and learn to ski all over again. Until you do that, you will likely just end up being held back and frustrated by your lack of progress.

Anybody Can Be An Expert Skier Book 1 is the place to start. Had I done that from the beginning, I would have saved myself at least two seasons of limited progress. Do the drills. Begin to develop one footed balance and a rudimentary two-footed release. Learn to make turns on gentle terrain by tipping your feet. That is the green progression. Then get Expert Skier 2 and learn how to ski with the Super Phantom. Develop a one footed release and build a basic brushed carve short turn. Then continue to refine movements until the short turn becomes bullet-proof and you are starting to make edge-carved turns that are orders of magnitude better than what you have now. That is the process and while it is involved, it may not take you as long as you think. Plus, if you accept the challenge inherent in the process, you will hopefully experience considerable enjoyment and satisfaction as you work to rebuild your skiing. In any event, if you want some useful MA feedback show us some skiing where you are working on something specific and ask us to give you feedback on whether you are accomplishing your goal. Posting video of drills can be useful as well as we can give you feedback on whether you are accomplishing them successfully.
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Re: MA for Husker Du

Postby HuskerDu » Sun Mar 15, 2015 11:51 am

Hi Geoff,

Thank you for your thoughtful examination of my movements and reinforcing what I have come to understand from my research on PTMS, a big factor of which, denotes dumping it all and starting over. I am fully aware that I have painted myself into a corner and will not develop any further from simply skiing more. I am not married to amy of those movements and, if you had seen the other 4 or 5 runs that were edited out, you would probably be recommending a good divorce attorney at the very least. I have viewed HH’s Whistler presentation on PMTS, am ready to buy the notion, drink the potion and dump all that old motion in the ocean. If I find the removal difficult, perhaps I may need to follow up here for some Post Mortem Termination Support. :)

My question is, what does bad habit removal look like? Sounds like we are talking about performing anything from a frontal lobotomy to employing a Vatican priest for an exorcism. Am I assuming correctly that indications of movements “entrenched” from too many miles of reinforcement is why you might be suggesting extra difficulty in learning PMTS? That may be my first worry. For starters, on my first full season return (next Dec) I am prepared to isolate my ski experience away from skiing with the “posse” or people with whom it impossible to both ski with and focus on new fundamentals and skiing primarily on beginner terrain. Getting the course material in advance is of no question for me at this point.

Finally, with this season’s end fast approaching and only a day or two ahead of me, would it be best to hold off absorbing the material until next season while I am skiing? Can any of it be applied through alpine inline skating?

Thank you,

H.D.
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Re: MA for Husker Du

Postby geoffda » Sun Mar 15, 2015 4:39 pm

HuskerDu wrote:My question is, what does bad habit removal look like? Sounds like we are talking about performing anything from a frontal lobotomy to employing a Vatican priest for an exorcism. Am I assuming correctly that indications of movements “entrenched” from too many miles of reinforcement is why you might be suggesting extra difficulty in learning PMTS? That may be my first worry. For starters, on my first full season return (next Dec) I am prepared to isolate my ski experience away from skiing with the “posse” or people with whom it impossible to both ski with and focus on new fundamentals and skiing primarily on beginner terrain. Getting the course material in advance is of no question for me at this point.

For many skiers (yourself included) it isn't so much "bad habit removal" as starting from the beginning and learning how to ski again. The best approach really is to start with Expert Skier 1 and begin working through it from the beginning. Even the most basic drills, such a simply standing in your boots and establishing the motions of tipping feet are very worthwhile. In starting from the beginning, what you will be doing is building a new way to make turns in order to replace what you are doing now. Literally, do nothing but the drills up to the point where you have built a turn. Then go ski with what you have built for awhile--that turn, those movements, nothing else. Then move on in the progression and build some more. Ski and repeat. The commitment lies in being willing to stay with skiing in this new, different way, even if it seems less fun or effective in the short term.

The difficulty will be that for a while, your new skiing seemingly won't allow you to do the things you can currently do on skis. You will have to resist the temptation to ski at speeds or in terrain that your new skiing won't yet support. Moreover, learning to ski with balance and precision is best done on gentle terrain at slow speeds anyway. You are starting over as a beginner skier and, as you have recognized, this will make you incompatible with your normal ski buddies. Really, free skiing as you know it is a thing of the past. Instead, it becomes about always skiing with a focus. Being aware at all times of what movement(s) you are actively trying to develop and whether they are working. When things aren't working, you take action to correct the situation. That might be anything from a simple stop and reset, to moving to easier terrain, to spending some time with drills to reestablish the movement. More than anything, you have to stick with the new and resist the temptation to go back to the old. The fastest progress will occur if you are willing to ski 100% with new movements--regardless of how well you can actually make them work. Be willing to look bad. As a few students have told me, "I can't look any worse than what I was doing..." That is the attitude that will help you the most.

You have to be willing to accept all of this as you work to redevelop your skiing. If you are going to be successful, it is important to start realizing that the process itself is fun. Certainly, experiencing success and improvement is the goal, but there will likely be times where things aren't going so well. Being able to still enjoy the moment is critical to perseverance during such times. I know one of the best side-effects of going through this process (for me) is that I no longer depend on conditions or terrain for my enjoyment of the sport. For me, it is all about bending the ski and I can do that no matter where I'm skiing or what the snow is like.

If you are serious about this, finding some coaching is likely going to be necessary. As good as Harald's materials are, we regularly see students coming to camp with some misunderstandings that need to be cleared up. Getting some coaching early in the process can be very beneficial and pay big dividends with respect to immediate improvement. If getting to a camp isn't in the cards, continue to take advantage of the MA forum. Skiing with fellow PMTS skiers can also accelerate your learning. You might be surprised at the quality of "second-hand" coaching that you can get from camp attendees.

HuskerDu wrote:Finally, with this season’s end fast approaching and only a day or two ahead of me, would it be best to hold off absorbing the material until next season while I am skiing? Can any of it be applied through alpine inline skating?

It depends on how you currently view the thought of rebuilding your skiing. If it seems exciting to you and you want to dive right into it, then by all means do. OTOH, if you are currently viewing the idea with some trepidation, I'd say wait until next season to start working on snow. My advice would be to do whatever will end your season on a high note.

As far as roller blade training goes, Harald has some exercises for this. See: https://www.harbskisystems.com/index.ph ... Itemid=356. Also, slantboard training is an excellent tool for the off-season. See: https://www.harbskisystems.com/index.ph ... Itemid=182. There are good exercises around building balance in Expert Skier 2. Finally, as you go through Harald's material, there are many opportunities for practicing movements on dry land. Many drills that demonstrate specific movements can be easily adapted to dry land on a flat surface or a slant board. Time spent in front of a mirror practicing movements can pay big dividends on snow. And while practicing in ski boots is ideal, if it seems like too much effort, don't discount practice in stocking feet. You can get a ton of tipping practice in that way.
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Re: MA for Husker Du

Postby Max_501 » Sun Mar 15, 2015 5:17 pm

IMO, make a slantboard and get started right away.

This link will take you through all 13 episodes of the youtube slantboard training videos HH created.

PMTS - Dryland Training with a Slantboard
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Re: MA for Husker Du

Postby HuskerDu » Tue Mar 17, 2015 1:25 pm

Geoff,

You speak softly but carry a big stick … works for me. Input that comes across in a manner as obviously sage as that tends to be the most effective for my ears.

I now see more clearly the relevance of MA only after a semblance of some understanding has been undertaken. No, this is a typical example of my flagrantly unpurposeful skiing.

Honestly, the majority of my form has been derived almost entirely through unconscious means and otherwise has been perilously adulterated over time with waning tides of popular notion … and look at me now, a freak show at a 1930’s farm town carnival. Ugh! Knees, elbows and God knows what else all over the map. Needless to say, I haven’t seen any real improvement in quite some time. I am in no place to simply reign things in. Almost three seasons off and now a fresh start.

This approach to skiing development comes across to me as more sophisticated yet far more simple to understand and to apply than anything I have seen. It only makes sense to learn from the bottom something founded from the top. I have always believed that a one of the benefits to a full set of sound fundamentals have always included its unwavering balance of value in any terrain. Who wouldn't gush over such an acquisition? I guess the time is now to reassemble an entirely new set of fundamentals and, for once, through a conscious and purposeful theft of somebody else’s ideas. :)

Being in the East, the camps are less accessible but I see there is one PMST teacher on the Right Coast. Someone at K-town certified to teach level green. As a yellow, that should work. I’ll email them.

Now, off to book #1., Series #1., Class #1., Essential #1., drill #1. and possibly an instructor lesson and video #2 before the close of season and a good start.

I thank you kindly for all your assistance,

H.D.
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Re: MA for Husker Du

Postby HuskerDu » Tue Mar 17, 2015 1:42 pm

Arothafel,

I thank you kindly for posting the embedded video for ease of use. Unfortunately, for some reason, everything is very darkened and, on top of being in a tiny frame, I couldn't see a thing compared to using the link. Personally, I also like to be able to slow it down when viewing other's skiing for myself. Perhaps I am using it incorrectly or it is a common night skiing effect. Anyway, I'm sure you are aware It can be hard enough garnering good feedback as it is already. ;)

Here is the link to YouTube: https://youtu.be/oCx5QwWpSuY
https://youtu.be/oCx5QwWpSuY

Thanks!

H.D.
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Re: MA for Husker Du

Postby geoffda » Tue Mar 17, 2015 3:45 pm

If you ski at Killington, PM ToddW. He has been to a bunch of camps and would definitely be a good resource for you. When you see him ski, you'll be surprised at what "not an expert skier" means in PMTS-land.

From the PMTS posse thread: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=4614&start=15
ToddW wrote:You're welcome to ski or do PMTS drills with me at Killington. I'm in Colorado Feb 28th through March 8th (PMTS lessons) Other than that, I'm usually at K every weekend. I'm not a trained instructor but I've been to some camps. Am definitely not an expert skier, but I can help you get started.
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Re: MA for Husker Du

Postby theorist » Tue Mar 17, 2015 6:57 pm

Just a suggestion from my own experience: In going through the drills in Expert 1, etc., I intially took notes with me onto the hill for each drill I wanted to practice. But I found the notes didn't capture enough of the details. I'm now going back through the drills, and this time I took a carpet knife to Expert 1, divided it into chapters, stapled each together, and stuff the chapter I'm drilling into my jacket. Alternately, you could bring the Kindle version with you on a smart phone, but with this approach you can't see the entire drill laid out all at once.
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Re: MA for Husker Du

Postby RRT » Wed Mar 18, 2015 4:53 pm

HuskerDu » Tue Mar 17, 2015 1:25 pm

Being in the East, the camps are less accessible but I see there is one PMST teacher on the Right Coast. Someone at K-town certified to teach level green. As a yellow, that should work. I’ll email them.


Be careful to make certain that's the case. I tried that 3 years back and it didn't really pan out. Certified, yes, but wasn't 100% committed to PMTS.
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Re: MA for Husker Du

Postby DougD » Thu Mar 19, 2015 3:57 am

geoffda wrote:If you ski at Killington, PM ToddW. He has been to a bunch of camps and would definitely be a good resource for you. When you see him ski, you'll be surprised at what "not an expert skier" means in PMTS-land.

From the PMTS posse thread: http://www.pmts.org/pmtsforum/viewtopic ... 4&start=15
ToddW wrote:You're welcome to ski or do PMTS drills with me at Killington. I'm in Colorado Feb 28th through March 8th (PMTS lessons) Other than that, I'm usually at K every weekend. I'm not a trained instructor but I've been to some camps. Am definitely not an expert skier, but I can help you get started.

+1

I've skied with Todd. He's a great guy who enjoys helping new PMTSers. Most skiers would indeed call him an expert. (Hell, most skiers call me an expert, which is laughable.) In Todd's case, only those with educated PMTS eyes could tell that he's not quite there yet. His skiing would be a worthy model for any PMTS newbie.
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Re: MA for Husker Du

Postby HuskerDu » Sun Mar 22, 2015 8:11 am

A lot of great leads and advice out of that one post! I will probably want to absorb the material before another video ma w/a drill or two as well as before catching up with some pmts skiers to pick their brains on the slopes. A lot to do. Thanks to all!
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