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Re: Off Piste Skiing

Postby h.harb » Mon Feb 03, 2020 7:31 pm

Great posts by Helluva and 501. Hate to say it but today I skied many different skis at the on-snow ski show. Stockli skis win. Heads skis suck. Even the race Head Sl skis felt terrible.
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Re: Off Piste Skiing

Postby B.Mulligan » Tue Feb 04, 2020 5:02 am

Hate to say it but today I skied many different skis at the on-snow ski show. Stockli skis win. Heads skis suck. Even the race Head Sl skis felt terrible.[/quote]

:shock: Feb 3, 2020-Harald Harb blows up the internet!
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Re: Off Piste Skiing

Postby h.harb » Tue Feb 04, 2020 7:22 am

Head is going down the wrong road, for next season's skis, they have this "graphene" thing going and the skis feel flimsy. This season's Super Shapes are still very good.
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Re: Off Piste Skiing

Postby HighAngles » Tue Feb 04, 2020 6:54 pm

ErikCO wrote:As to Harald's reviews on skis, that is disappointing. Why do the ski companies insist on changing all their skis up every few years? They should keep a few models that are essentially unchanged for a good number of years and only "update" them very carefully.


A bit of thread drift... but to answer the posed question. There is the belief that "change" will breed new interest and drive the sales. Unfortunately the industry is stuck in this "going lighter is better" rut for the past couple seasons. This drive to continue to reduce weight means that most manufacturers are incorporating materials that are strong, but light. The fallacy though in this approach is that those lighter stronger materials don't necessarily add up to skis that feel good on the snow. This "lighter is better" is a disease that has infected the sport. Eventually they'll all hopefully come back to their senses if they get enough feedback. If not, once everything is "light" then they'll once again need "change" and they'll go back in the other direction. ;)
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Re: Off Piste Skiing

Postby h.harb » Wed Feb 05, 2020 12:47 pm

I found a number of good skis at Stockli. We will bring in some Stockli skis to the shop. We will research the carving skis from Blossom as well. They were not in the show but we can get them in Europe from the factory. The Heads, Fischer, were very disappointing. Some of the wide skis that people rave about are junk. The Rip Stick and Volkl equivalent are really bad skis if you want a solid product under your feet. I am keeping my present Head skis, which are so much better than next year's product.
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Re: Off Piste Skiing

Postby jbotti » Wed Feb 05, 2020 6:59 pm

Pretty much every great ski that Head has made (and there have been many) they have changed and or discontinued and the replacements have generally sucked. So disappointing!!
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Re: Off Piste Skiing

Postby blackthorn » Wed Feb 05, 2020 8:00 pm

I am looking to buy a wide ski for New Zealand conditions - maritime climate and small basins, to ski new snow. I really do not want a charger, but one suitable for short-medium turns. They would not be used, to any degree, on groomed runs.

They would be to complement my Dynastar Speedzone and Movement Jam skis. I'm thinking of something with a waist in the 99 - 106mm range. Certainly no need for anything wider. I do have an old pair of K2 Hardside but they are very stiff and not very enjoyable.

They would likely only be used 6 - 8 times a season.

Does anyone have suggestions?
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Re: Off Piste Skiing

Postby jbotti » Wed Feb 05, 2020 9:10 pm

Read my review of the Liberty Evolv 100. I have now skied it quite a bit this season. Its a good ski that rewards PMTS movements and its a great off piste ski.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5570
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Re: Off Piste Skiing

Postby B.Mulligan » Thu Feb 06, 2020 5:34 am

I've had good luck with the new Liberty VMT line as well.

I just picked up this years VMT 76-which they added a bit more metal to, it's a very engaging all mountain ski.

Anyone ever get to ski the Blossom Tail Wind???
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Head 2021

Postby jbotti » Thu Feb 06, 2020 10:34 am

Moved from PMTS section
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Re: Head 2021

Postby blackthorn » Thu Feb 06, 2020 11:44 am

Thanks for your comments JB. I had read your report on the Liberty Evolv 100. Unfortunately Liberty skis are not readily available in New Zealand or Europe where I ski.
The characteristics of the ski design certainly reflect what one might be expected to be a good ski to reward PMTS technique.
I suspect I may have to get a ski that has some less desirable components but in that they will not be used a great deal then it is likely to be less important overall.
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Re: Head 2021

Postby jbotti » Thu Feb 06, 2020 12:24 pm

Of Rockered Skis in the Rocker 3.0 category (plenty of tip and tail Rocker but less than what Rossi has done for years with their super rockered skis) the Head Kores are the best of the bunch IMO. I have skied the 93 and the 99. Everyone who has skied the 105 has loved it. I am supposed to go heli skiing next Thursday and the skis they have for me are Head Kore 105s. I can let you know after I ski them assuming weather permits.

You can read this which I posted on the Kore 93 a while back:

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5252
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Re: Head 2021

Postby VAskier » Thu Feb 06, 2020 12:28 pm

h.harb wrote:Great posts by Helluva and 501. Hate to say it but today I skied many different skis at the on-snow ski show. Stockli skis win. Heads skis suck. Even the race Head Sl skis felt terrible.


jbotti wrote:Moved from PMTS section


For future readers of the forum, if you want to know to which great posts (by Helluva and 501) Harald is referring, they are in this thread: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2715
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Re: Head 2021

Postby HighAngles » Fri Feb 07, 2020 1:46 pm

jbotti wrote:Of Rockered Skis in the Rocker 3.0 category (plenty of tip and tail Rocker but less than what Rossi has done for years with their super rockered skis) the Head Kores are the best of the bunch IMO. I have skied the 93 and the 99. Everyone who has skied the 105 has loved it. I am supposed to go heli skiing next Thursday and the skis they have for me are Head Kore 105s. I can let you know after I ski them assuming weather permits.

You can read this which I posted on the Kore 93 a while back:

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5252


The Kore series are surprisingly damp/quiet for their light weight, but they just can't escape their light weight which does not provide the greatest stability at speed. Not an issue unless you end up in a lot of crud.

The new Kore 87 is coming while Monster 88 is leaving. The Kore 87 is in no way a replacement for the M88. They couldn't be more different in how they ski. The 87 is light and "flippy" and it's difficult to find some edge grip on the groomed.

I have ridden quite a few of the wide Fischer Ti series skis. What I like about them is they are also damp like the Kores, not quite as light feeling, and although they have rocker in the tips and tails, they are not also ridiculously soft in the tips and tails. If a ski is already rockered (effectively bent for a turn) then it doesn't need to be soft too. If it's soft then the tips flap around and I hate to see/feel that. The Kores have a slightly deeper sidecut so they ski quicker on hardpack, but once you get them into 3D conditions the rocker takes over and the Kores and the Fischers have a similar amount of splay in the rocker line. Thus I think they would be similarly quick turning in deeper snow.
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Re: Off Piste Skiing

Postby skiffie » Fri Feb 07, 2020 5:24 pm

h.harb wrote:I found a number of good skis at Stockli. We will bring in some Stockli skis to the shop. We will research the carving skis from Blossom as well. They were not in the show but we can get them in Europe from the factory. The Heads, Fischer, were very disappointing. Some of the wide skis that people rave about are junk. The Rip Stick and Volkl equivalent are really bad skis if you want a solid product under your feet. I am keeping my present Head skis, which are so much better than next year's product.


Glad you have found some skis that still work! But with Head going this way I would be a bit worried that eventually there will be no skis that are suitable for PMTS. Then what? lol.
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